Forum Replies Created
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They are asking $125,000 – which I reckon is either cheap, expensive or about right, depending on its condition. 😀
Well, I suppose anything might come up for sale, theoretically. But, when you are dealing with only a handful of cars in the world, a number of which being owned by the same person and most in long-term ownership, the odds of finding what you appear to want without searching out one of those ‘lost’ cars seem quite slim (putting it mildly). There are a few average and good cars that have come on to the market, some more than once in recent times. But, these days the price commanded reflects the rarity of the cars.
Tim
Can anyone else help further with this query? In an ideal world, some photographs of the tools in situ in the boot of the 3 litre Lagonda would be wonderful. I have currently only the Jackall handle, the starting handle, and the drain plug spanner (replica).
Alan,
Can you post a picture of 130 or send to me / us via email please? I don’t know whether David already has a copy. By the way, might we possibly dispense with the term ‘look alike’, since they don’t? 😀
There is a photograph of 137 in the Catalogue of British Cars (p.196) as you may know.
Tim
“The 2 DB4/5 look a likes..” Do you mean Rapides that are fitted with a DB4/5 grille? If so, I can help re one of them (137) – it is currently in the very early stages of a ground-up restoration to my certain knowledge.
I have now read the piece in C&S. It is, as ever, a typical example of modern print journalism and of commentary on the post-war Lagondas – superficial, littered with hyperbole, exaggeration and inappropriate ‘modern’ perspective and ‘side’, and inaccurate not only in some of the minor details given (forgivable) but also in respect of very basic points of historical importance (unforgivable) e.g. the relative importance of the two marques intra-brand when David Brown acquired them, the relative success of the 2.6 and 3 litre models in production, and the real premise for the battle between John Wyer and David Brown re funding the Rapide project.
In fact, IMHO by comparison the article is not quite as bad as that which appeared in Octane magazine a year or so ago on the ‘4 door’ Aston Martins, which for me was a real journalistic low point for that publication.
It sounds to me as if Alan and David need to get their heads together a little (more). 🙂
Alan, with respect, an individual chassis number is not data that is private or personal to anyone. However, linking an individual to such data is a private and personal matter, of course. 🙂 AMOC / AMHT is able to (and does) make the former available to the public and, indeed, the ‘public’ part of the Register is available for purchase by non-members. Perhaps the Lagonda Club should consider making a similar provision?
All the best,
Tim
Thanks for the ‘heads up’, Christian.
Martin used to have a Rapide a few years back and gave monthly updates in the magazine about it as a ‘staffer car’. He even wrote to me some time ago, looking for help about an article (though I can’t now recall the outcome). I assume that he sold the car, but David will know.
David, I agree re the Irish car. Were I in Francis’ shoes, given what he has said I think I would partake of that adventure – not too many further / other opportunities of its ilk seem likely in the future.
I have never seen snaps of the Cartier car. The only first hand knowledge that I have of it was gleaned from the man himself. I had assumed (a) that the mink was still in place, and (b) he would retain it. Quite another question is whether, if it was removed at some point before purchase, he would have it replaced? I rather think I can guess the correct answer! 😀
Francis, just in case you don’t know about it, the Cartier car was commissioned for / by the ‘Mrs Cartier’ of the time (i.e. wife of scion etc.). It has been in several collections to date, is reputed to be in perfect condition, and features mink-lined upholstery!
Perhaps your restoration plans will not include such provision? 😆
Re the Cartier car, ‘he’ certainly had it (still), he told me, last year. Although an avid collector, the gentleman in question has been known to change his mind radically overnight about many things. 😉 So, it is certainly very far from inconceivable (in my view) that he might sell it on a whim. But, Francis, be warned – it will be mega-bucks if he parts with it. And, we wouldn’t necessarily get to hear about it if the thing was for sale.
The Irish car is out there (somewhere) but I’m not sure where I’d begin any search. Over to you, David.
Super stuff – and the black one is on wires too!
Essentially, so far as I can see, the cars all fall into one of three categories (perhaps all classics do so): (1) projects; (2) good drivers; and (3) very good cars. IIRC, only category (1) and (2) cars have come onto the open market in recent times.
In the main, the category (2) cars have popped up at auction. They seem to make now circa ?70-80k. Such category (3) cars that have changed hands in recent years (so far as I am aware) have done so privately, and for (of course) undisclosed sums, between collectors. A good example would be the so-called Cartier car. This was bought in 2008 by someone I know for (I imagine) several hundred thousand pounds. But, it will be in perfect or near perfect concours condition (naturally).
The market for these cars is necessarily tiny. The value of category (1) and (2) cars has, until very recently, been low (even very low). Now, just like the DB Aston market, my impression is that many (if not almost all) remaining DB Lagondas (at least the 3 litres and the Rapides) are now being bought by those prepared to spend significant amounts of money on their complete restoration. In other words, it seems to me that the Lagonda market now is mimicking the Aston market of the last decade or so, for first the 4, 5 & 6s and then (latterly) the 2, 2/4, MkIII, and Ss.
In terms of the Rapides, when you are dealing with only 55 cars manufactured I imagine that in 10 or 15 years time they will all be in the hands of collectors and driver-enthusiasts, all will be in very good condition or better, and all will be very expensive.
However, right now, it is clear that if you are very lucky indeed, you can still pick up a car in the ?5-35k bracket. Just be aware that ?100k+ worth of work will be required to bring the car up to where it should be.
Tim
The DB7 Vantage was available with a Tremec 6-speed manual box (the set being a cut unique to that car). In relative terms, they are rare because most chose the ZF 5 speed auto (both boxes being different from those offered for the DB7). IMHO, for a ‘modern’ Aston the DB7 Vantage in manual coupe form is wonderful combination for everyday / GT use. However, enough of all that – this is a Lagonda forum! 😀
As David has indicated, there are a few ‘original’ NA cars. I assume (and he / someone will correct me if I am wrong) that all of these, together with those delivered new to continental Europe, are left hand drive. Frankly, it seems to me that conversion to LHD from RHD (though no doubt possible) would be a pointless exercise. However, conversion to either the DB 4-speed or ZF 5-speed seems to me to be a much more practical proposition that, in any event, has already been achieved re several cars.
Good luck with it all.
Tim
Francis,
I’m sorry that your became bored with your DB7 – my 7 Vantage is a constant joy for me (at least, when it’s working properly 😆 ).
I am very fortunate indeed to own a small number of both pre- and post-war Lagondas, although all of these are projects. One such car is a DB Rapide – we recently acquired it and, indeed, work begins on the full restoration this coming week! It is a manual example that also happens to be one of only two (if that) fitted with a DB4/5 grille (there are in fact 5 different versions of front end of which I am aware, if you count the Touring prototype design).
As you probably know very well, only 55 cars were built. It took me 4 years to acquire my example, after a very kind person (and friend), who is also a member of both this forum and that of the AMOC, gave me a wonderful lead. It really can be a difficult quest, although things do fall out of the sky sometimes – you just need to read Christian’s story, as an example of how fortune does sometimes shine. IIRC, there are still about 4 cars that are still unaccounted for.
If you are serious about buying a Rapide right now, you might try contacting this trader: http://www.romangarage.co.uk. I think that the car he was offering (though it’s not depicted on the website) has now been sold but it might be worth a call. Also, re a a search in North America, in addition to Steel Wings you might try also Kevin Kay Restorations in Redding, CA.
In my opinion, these cars are wonderful – so beautiful, rare and interesting. I wish you all the very best with your hunt.
Tim
Thanks very much, Peter.